Sega's latest mini-console, the Astro City Mini V, has just been released, bringing 22 vertical shmups to people who may not have had access to many of these Japan-only, arcade-only titles before... but, let's be realistic, this teeny-tiny little cabinet is for the kind of hardcore arcade nerds that can afford to drop $180 on something this specific. No shame in that, though!
Unfortunately, as pointed out in multiple reviews (including our own Damien McFerran's review over on our new sister site, Time Extension), the input lag is extreme, marring the experience a fair bit. Here's how Damien describes it:
"The latency is so extreme it actually becomes noticeable during play, and when you're playing 'twitch' genres like shooters, even the smallest amount of lag can prove fatal."
Over on Twitter, @moftsoft ran informal tests to determine how bad the lag was, finding that it ranged from six to ten frames depending on the game, and pointing out that some of the games have lag in the game itself, compounded by the Astro City Mini V's own problems.
Some have stated that the lag can be fixed by switching out the power supply. The Astro City Mini V uses a micro-USB port to charge, so you can just use any old charger — but specifically, as the reports state, you have to use a 5V power supply.
This method appeared to work for YouTube reviewer Madlittlepixel, but not for our reviewer, who tested the Astro City Mini V with a Storm 2 Liquid power bank.
Here's a wee excerpt from Damien's review to give you an idea of why all of this is important:
"Does this render the Astro City Mini V unplayable? No, of course not. It's still possible to enjoy the games included here, despite the presence of input lag.
However, a good analogy to use here is what happened in Europe in the '80s and '90s; European players had to endure PAL conversions which ran slower than their NTSC counterparts and were saddled with ugly black borders at the top and bottom of the display.
Did this stop millions of players from enjoying the likes of Sonic, Mario and Zelda? Of course it didn't, but the moment a PAL gamer saw a game running at its true speed in full-screen via NTSC, there was no going back. Likewise, if you play any of these titles elsewhere (some are even supported by the excellent FPGA MiSTer platform now), the difference in responsiveness is like night and day, which is a crying shame."
Hey, at least we got some gorgeous photos out of the darn thing.
Have you bought the Astro City Mini V? Have you changed your mind about buying it because of the lag issue? Tell us in the comments!
Please note that some external links on this page are affiliate links, which means if you click them and make a purchase we may receive a small percentage of the sale. Please read our FTC Disclosure for more information.
Comments 28
Bad news. I was really looking forward for this.
Long time PAL gamer. My NTSC ignorance is bliss.
But still, frame lag in those scrolling SHMUPs would potentially be a deal breaker. 5 frames is going to probably be in the order of 0.2 seconds. (Assuming it’s at 24 FPS, which might be a bad assumption from my PAL days - was NTSC 30fps??). Even I would notice 0.2 seconds and that would be super frustrating I expect
These are starting to look like AtGames level of quality.
A new Sega product was made rushed and shoddy to turn a quick profit? I am shocked./s
I got the first one with the super-elusive accessory kit that makes it looks like an actual mini arcade machine. Cool novelty item, but I hardly use it, it's more so just a cool looking thing to have on a desk or shelf.
Honestly, that's sort of the problem I got with all of these mini-arcade deals. They are pretty neat as novelty items, but they aren't the kind of things I get much use out of. It's why I lost interest in continuing to buy them, especially as they kept getting more expensive.
omg ffs Sega, just do a Saturn/Dreamcast mini and stop faffing about.
That's disappointing. I'm guessing M2 wasn't involved with this one like the Genesis/MD mini consoles. Those are great quality, like everything they work on.
@Maulbert The genesis mini was a great product and better than any of Nintendo's mini consoles as someone who likes Nintendo more. Sega has put out some great products
I have had this problem with the capcom home arcade I found that using different power supplies can have varying effects on how the unit runs the one that came with it wouldn’t even turn on at first I got it working but it kept on giving me a black screen when things got hectic on certain games I ended up buying a good quality psu and now it runs fine
I have this unit - you only get bad lag if you use a junk power supply. Just use a iPhone USBA charger.
That's too bad, I was never really in the market for it but it sucks for collectors and diehard shmuppers. I'm just a casual fan, but that much input lag is noticeable even for casuals.
Sega is such a frustrating company, sometimes their products are solid A-grade and sometimes they totally just phone it in - and you never know which kind you're getting until you have the thing in your hands.
Multiple buyers of this mini arcade have attempted trying different power supplies with no success in reducing lag. Its just a bad product, unfortunately.
I have one. Live in Japan and got it release day. I have had no issues playing on the tiny screen or on my 75" Sony TV via HDMI. I'm going to chalk this report into the bin, lunked together with those "if it's not 60FPS then it's unplayable" people.
Once again, hooked to my TV via HDMI, playing with the Astro Pad. Thoroughly enjoyable, very, very happy I bought it.
Nobody is talking about voltage at the Shmups forum.
It's amperage that seems to be affecting input latency on this device for Japanese buyers (As well as the Taito system and the previous Sega Astro City Mini), with some importers also reporting similar improvements when going to a higher amp psu.
The Tweet says "3.18W", not 3.18V. The W stands for watts (Mathematically, watts are amps multiplied by volts).
Edit: While there's no acknowledgement of a correction shown, she's since changed the article a little bit to remove her mistake. It initially said what I'll quote below, which was worthy of clarification since watts and volts aren't one and the same.
SEGA have a really lovely ball, it's just a shame they keep dropping it. Their QA and test departments need a kick up the bum and align themselves with customer expectations somehow.
@aznable you think any business is willing to bring back commercially failed products? Saturn and Dreamcast sold very poorly worldwide. The numbers are so bad that no one in Sega would say there’s a market today. And Sega’s leadership isn’t going to look bad losing money again on those consoles even if there was a gamble to be made in some niche nostalgia
@Atariboy even with proper power, the problem seems to persist. Sega’s using chips that just can’t emulate with any efficiency. Because they are selling to a collector market, they surely don’t care about input lag, not enough to buy better parts
If any large company could bungle a no brainer like latency with shmups it's going to be Sega. I love Sega stuff and always will but they couldn't even keep their US and Japan offices aligned. They've never been quite right, particularly after Sony ate their lunch with the PS1 which should be considered bullying the disadvantaged kid.
@Hck Not every level of enjoyment is limited by lag. The less precision you seek the less lag is even going to be noticed. I see plenty of online fighting game players rematch in 6, 7, and even 15+ frames of delay. That's insane (to me) but they're just mashing, so they hardly even notice, I'm sure.
What a mess. Fan emulation is better than official emulation lol
2 frames of added lag makes these games unplayable. 10 Is just a disgrace.
@NinChocolate Bruh nostalgia IS the money right now... Stranger Things, funko pop, the entire Star Wars franchise re-re-reemergence... Geriatric millennials like myself are spending our money or crap we wanted as kids but didn't have the money to get.
$180 for this piece of junk, and you're saying there is no market for a Saturn or Dreamcast mini? Panzer Dragoon Saga, Burning Rangers, or Shining Force 3 ALONE would sell the Saturn mini, regardless of whatever the rest of the library they should slap in there.
Niche nostalgia my buttocks.
Weird analogy with pal and ntsc... ofcourse it run slowing , but it ran in frame, making some games per haps easier, and only slowing if you compared them (and on compiter like the amiga we had the advange:50 extra pixels)... while 10 frames lag means you don't stand a change to react.. 1/3 of a second with 30fps is a hell of a lag..
Never had imagined the amps of a power supply could do this though..
The input lag from my brain to my fingers is way more than that so I’ll still get one when they arrive here!
I never experience the input lag they were complaining about. I tried all the games from my unit powered by a 5 volts, 3 amp power brick while hooked to monitor via HDMI and I also have the scanline effects turned on.
I was afraid of that lag issue after all I could read and hear, but now I have it in my hands and played it a lot, I can affirm that it's way better than I expected. Use a proper AC adapter and plug the official pad in it, it's perfectly playable. Although maybe not as fast as if it was the real PCB, the response is good enough to improve, play and have a great time on Bakraid, Batrider, VV, Batsugun... Those who pretend it's unplayable are telling bull*hit. This is a lovely gem for older gamers, and quite a nice improvement of the previous Astro City Mini.
Glad I got this.. I's alot of fun! I like using the game pad but would love if they brought back the arcade stick just to try it out.
How many mini systems is sega going to make? This one literally had no connection to any other system. This is going to be for a person that knows nothing from sega and says “ Oh! I remember that!” To be honest it is nice to have when you have nothing to do.
Tap here to load 28 comments
Leave A Comment
Hold on there, you need to login to post a comment...